PRE-GAME Round 7 - Broncos vs Sharks

[Unbreakable]

Stupid coach.

You're just joking yeah?

 

[Wolfie]

You're just joking yeah?

Maybe. Maybe not. Dont rate TPJ as a starter ( unless its against the Cowboys ) so at the moment i think it should be Joffa or Carrigan starting lock. I think its a bit lame to drop any player who has been doing his job, and Carrigan was doing his job. I'm still of the mind that we would be better server with TPJ, Joffa and Flegler as bench forwards,( one solid player, 2 great impact players ) and either Staggs or Glenn as the other bench player, and Lodge, Haas and Flegler as our props and lock starting with Fifita and Gillett as back rowers.

I'm becoming less and less convinced by Seibold as the weeks go by though if i am being honest. Not writing him off, but i dont think he has had the balls to make any tough decisions, so many players who could quite easily be replaced and they are still there. I'll keep my powder dry for another few weeks yet in terms of really judging how i feel he is going. Hopefully we start to turn things around from Saturday.

 

[Unbreakable]

Not writing him off, but i dont think he has had the balls to make any tough decisions

You mean like starting a 20 year old with 5 games of NRL experience over an international with 80 games of NRL experience?.. That seems like a moderately tough decision to make.

Seibold has always said that he was going to wait until Round 8 to reassess the team because he wanted to give them 2 months to prove themselves, so it'd be pretty irresponsible for anyone to "write him off" prior to that.

I know you like Carrigan, but it's really starting to cloud your judgement if you're legitimately upset that he's dropping him to bring Lodge back in.. It's not like he's dropping him to find room for Shaun Fensom.

 

[Renegade]

Maybe. Maybe not. Dont rate TPJ as a starter ( unless its against the Cowboys ) so at the moment i think it should be Joffa or Carrigan starting lock. I think its a bit lame to drop any player who has been doing his job, and Carrigan was doing his job. I'm still of the mind that we would be better server with TPJ, Joffa and Flegler as bench forwards,( one solid player, 2 great impact players ) and either Staggs or Glenn as the other bench player, and Lodge, Haas and Flegler as our props and lock starting with Fifita and Gillett as back rowers.

I'm becoming less and less convinced by Seibold as the weeks go by though if i am being honest. Not writing him off, but i dont think he has had the balls to make any tough decisions, so many players who could quite easily be replaced and they are still there. I'll keep my powder dry for another few weeks yet in terms of really judging how i feel he is going. Hopefully we start to turn things around from Saturday.

Maybe we're like one of those bigass ships that takes an era to turn around but starts juggernauting once it's on course.

 

[Wolfie]

You mean like starting a 20 year old with 5 games of NRL experience over an international with 80 games of NRL experience?.. That seems like a moderately tough decision to make.

Seibold has always said that he was going to wait until Round 8 to reassess the team because he wanted to give them 2 months to prove themselves, so it'd be pretty irresponsible for anyone to "write him off" prior to that.

I know you like Carrigan, but it's really starting to cloud your judgement if you're legitimately upset that he's dropping him to bring Lodge back in.. It's not like he's dropping him to find room for Shaun Fensom.

I'm not clouded in the slightest, as is obvious the other day when i put on here i'd be putting Joffa at lock even though he probably doesnt deserve it. I think he has consistently got the team wrong, our record pretty much backs it up. Carrigan at a guess would be making as many meters per run in the two games he has played as Joffa, or Flegler has, which are the two i guess he would be competing against for a spot, and i cant recall him missing many tackles or making any errors. Not sure on what planet players who perform get dropped while ones who dont stay in the side.

If Seibold made the tough choices, why has it taken him 7 weeks to decide to stop shoehorning 4 back rowers into the side, especially when one of them has clearly not been fit. Why isnt he dropping Glenn for Fifita who has been our best back rower? Joffa has been bang average this year, yet he isnt dropped. Its not like in the backs where we dont have the options to replace Issako or Boyd, we have plenty of forward options.

And i never said i would leave Lodge out for Carrigan. I have posted my pack twice now in the last day i think. Do keep up.

 

[Unbreakable]

I'm not clouded in the slightest, as is obvious the other day when i put on here i'd be putting Joffa at lock even though he probably doesnt deserve it. I think he has consistently got the team wrong, our record pretty much backs it up. Carrigan at a guess would be making as many meters per run in the two games he has played as Joffa, or Flegler has, which are the two i guess he would be competing against for a spot, and i cant recall him missing many tackles or making any errors. Not sure on what planet players who perform get dropped while ones who dont stay in the side.

If Seibold made the tough choices, why has it taken him 7 weeks to decide to stop shoehorning 4 back rowers into the side, especially when one of them has clearly not been fit. Why isnt he dropping Glenn for Fifita who has been our best back rower? Joffa has been bang average this year, yet he isnt dropped. Its not like in the backs where we dont have the options to replace Issako or Boyd, we have plenty of forward options.

And i never said i would leave Lodge out for Carrigan. I have posted my pack twice now in the last day i think. Do keep up.

You're contradicting yourself at every turn man, it's hard to keep up when you're not consistent.

i'd be putting Joffa at lock

Joffa has been bang average this year, yet he isnt dropped

You'd be putting Joffa at lock, but you're complaining that he isn't dropped. Which one is it?

Also, your rational for keeping Carrigan in the team is full of holes as well.

You're saying the reason you think he should stay in the team is because he has made as many metres per run in two games off the bench in limited minutes as Ofahengaue or Flegler has..

Firstly, that's false. Carrigan is making 11.52 metres per run, Flegler is making 13.22 metres per run & Ofahengaue is making 10.83 metres per run. And I'd wager that the only reason Ofahengaue is averaging fewer metres per run is because he's starting and playing significantly higher minutes against better players, and also fresher players. It'll be interesting to see the sort of impact he has off the bench this week.

Secondly, you say that "Not sure on what planet players who perform get dropped while ones who dont stay in the side", who specifically are you referring to here? It's certainly not Flegler, who has outperformed Carrigan at every step, including pre-season. So it must be Ofahengaue. He has made some poor defensive plays and is getting way too lazy at the end of his stints, hence why I believe Seibold has relegated him to the bench this week, but to say he "hasn't been performing" comparatively to a guy who's having minimal impact and playing 15 minutes per game off the bench in second halves is just ludicrous, even for you.

 

[ChewThePhatt]

You're contradicting yourself at every turn man, it's hard to keep up when you're not consistent.





You'd be putting Joffa at lock, but you're complaining that he isn't dropped. Which one is it?

Also, your rational for keeping Carrigan in the team is full of holes as well.

You're saying the reason you think he should stay in the team is because he has made as many metres per run in two games off the bench in limited minutes as Ofahengaue or Flegler has..

Firstly, that's false. Carrigan is making 11.52 metres per run, Flegler is making 13.22 metres per run & Ofahengaue is making 10.83 metres per run. And I'd wager that the only reason Ofahengaue is averaging fewer metres per run is because he's starting and playing significantly higher minutes against better players, and also fresher players. It'll be interesting to see the sort of impact he has off the bench this week.

Secondly, you say that "Not sure on what planet players who perform get dropped while ones who dont stay in the side", who specifically are you referring to here? It's certainly not Flegler, who has outperformed Carrigan at every step, including pre-season. So it must be Ofahengaue. He has made some poor defensive plays and is getting way too lazy at the end of his stints, hence why I believe Seibold has relegated him to the bench this week, but to say he "hasn't been performing" comparatively to a guy who's having minimal impact and playing 15 minutes per game off the bench in second halves is just ludicrous, even for you.

I believe the point here is that Party isn't an impact player. He's a long minute starting workhorse.

 

[Unbreakable]

I believe the point here is that Party isn't an impact player. He's a long minute starting workhorse.
Get it?

If that were the case he wouldn't have said he'd be playing Ofahengaue at lock, but we won't expect too much consistency from the lad.

For what it's worth I would having Carrigan in the team as well, but things take time. Seibold really only just arrived at the club, he said in the early season he wouldn't be considering any large changes until Round 8, he's not going to start off his tenure with a lie and start dropping players before that point in time. He'd also probably lose the fans and senior playing group if he just starts dropping senior members of the squad like Glenn & Joffa, so he's trying to tow the line of putting out the best 17 and not stepping on too many toes too early in to his tenure. People just need to exercise some self control and patience. It's just amusing that it's the same people who are defending Boyd to the death and getting fair up anyone who is even questioning his place in the team that are getting up Seibold for not wielding the axe and writing him off after 6 weeks, haha, absolute clowns.

 

[Alec]

Carrigan hasn't set a foot wrong in his limited time, but yeah, Flegler has definitely shown more so far. He had more opportunity, but he took it with both hands.

I do agree with some of the things Wolfie is saying though. Glenn has been really unimpressive, I'd definitely be dropping him to the bench for now. I dunno how Fifita goes on the left though?

I'm also not a huge fan of Ofa, and I hope it doesn't take Carrigan long to surpass him.

 

[Wolfie]

How about you make a fair comparison for a start. Compare the Tigers and the Raiders
games figures. Not really a fair comparison when Carrigan hasnt had our only dominant game of the year against the Cowboys to pad out his stats.

Secondly, i'm not contradicting anything. Me saying Joffa has been bang average and hasnt been dropped is in reference to Seibold not making tough decisions. You couldnt argue if he did, but he hasnt. Did i say it was what i would do? Nope. I'd be happy to Joffa get a shot at lock as he was great there last year, but i'd also have no issues playing Carrigan either.

I also dont think Flegler has been any better than Pat. In fact, i have consistently said since round one, and probably before as well, Flegler is a better option from the bench than Carrigan because he is more of an impact player.

 

[Wolfie]

If that were the case he wouldn't have said he'd be playing Ofahengaue at lock, but we won't expect too much consistency from the lad.

For what it's worth I would having Carrigan in the team as well, but things take time. Seibold really only just arrived at the club, he said in the early season he wouldn't be considering any large changes until Round 8, he's not going to start off his tenure with a lie and start dropping players before that point in time. He'd also probably lose the fans and senior playing group if he just starts dropping senior members of the squad like Glenn & Joffa, so he's trying to tow the line of putting out the best 17 and not stepping on too many toes too early in to his tenure. People just need to exercise some self control and patience. It's just amusing that it's the same people who are defending Boyd to the death and getting fair up anyone who is even questioning his place in the team that are getting up Seibold for not wielding the axe and writing him off after 6 weeks, haha, absolute clowns.

Like i said, i'd be happy with Joffa or Carrigan at lock. But i have consistently said Carrigan is a better as a starter.

Also, show me where i have said Boyd deserves his place as well? You are making shit up if you think i'd prefer him at fullback. In my ideal team if you look back i pretty much have him replaced every time.

 

[broncsgoat]

Fleg's been declining in quality after a red hot start iyam.

 

[Wolfie]

Fleg's been declining in quality after a red hot start iyam.

I dont think he has got any worse, i just dont think he has the motor for the minutes he is playing. Even last year, he was only ever great for short spells. He is a great impact player.

 

[Battler]

Assuming we keep TPJ, I'd say that Joffa is on his way out of the club based on those comments. I won't be crying over the loss based on this year.

 

[Unbreakable]

How about you make a fair comparison for a start. Compare the Tigers and the Raiders
games figures. Not really a fair comparison when Carrigan hasnt had our only dominant game of the year against the Cowboys to pad out his stats.

Valid point

Secondly, i'm not contradicting anything. Me saying Joffa has been bang average and hasnt been dropped is in reference to Seibold not making tough decisions. You couldnt argue if he did, but he hasnt. Did i say it was what i would do? Nope. I'd be happy to Joffa get a shot at lock as he was great there last year, but i'd also have no issues playing Carrigan either.

I disagree with the sentiment that Ofahengaue has been bang average, despite the lack of match fitness which becomes evident in the tail end of his stints, he's still putting up more than acceptable numbers for a starting prop.

11.3 runs, 122.4 metres, 38.8 PCM, 33.6 tackles @ 89% efficiency.

Not exactly screaming out to be dropped.

I also dont think Flegler has been any better than Pat. In fact, i have consistently said since round one, and probably before as well, Flegler is a better option from the bench than Carrigan because he is more of an impact player.

Well I mean.. if you're openly admitting that Flegler is a better bench option to Carrigan I really don't see what the issue is here, TPJ & Joe will get first crack at cementing the starting 13 spot over Carrigan, that's just how life works. Neither of those two are playing poor enough to be "must drops" for Seibold, and Carrigan isn't playing so unbelievably well that he's demanding selection ahead of their of them, so you're just going to have to bide your time along with Patty, his chance will come to start this season, don't worry about that.

I hope this doesn't look like I'm against Carrigan, because I'm absolutely not, I've really enjoyed his 2 games and think he's got huge potential, I hope he kills when he gets another chance.

 

[Alec]

Fleg's been declining in quality after a red hot start iyam.

He was still pretty impressive against the Raiders, played 34 mins, picked up 120 metres.

 

[Wolfie]

Valid point



I disagree with the sentiment that Ofahengaue has been bang average, despite the lack of match fitness which becomes evident in the tail end of his stints, he's still putting up more than acceptable numbers for a starting prop.

11.3 runs, 122.4 metres, 38.8 PCM, 33.6 tackles @ 89% efficiency.

Not exactly screaming out to be dropped.



Well I mean.. if you're openly admitting that Flegler is a better bench option to Carrigan I really don't see what the issue is here, TPJ & Joe will get first crack at cementing the starting 13 spot over Carrigan, that's just how life works. Neither of those two are playing poor enough to be "must drops" for Seibold, and Carrigan isn't playing so unbelievably well that he's demanding selection ahead of their of them, so you're just going to have to bide your time along with Patty, his chance will come to start this season, don't worry about that.

I hope this doesn't look like I'm against Carrigan, because I'm absolutely not, I've really enjoyed his 2 games and think he's got huge potential, I hope he kills when he gets another chance.

My gripe is like i said, he hasnt put a foot wrong and gets demoted ( unless you class 1 missed tackle as putting a foot wrong ). I dont think he deserves it. I know Haas has been really good as well, and i wouldnt drop him at all, but he has played 2 games for us and has been directly at fault for 2 tries. Joffa, imo and basing it off last years form, has been bang average. He can be a lot better than he is. As much as i see Pat as a starter, we have improved both times he has come onto the field for us. I dont need stats to see it, thats what my eyes are for. He isnt a big impact player, but that still doesnt mean he cant be an effective bench player either. I'm not exactly saying Flegler is a better bench option as such either, i'm saying of you want a player who will offer big impact, you go with a Flegler type player. Depends on what you want.

And while i'm not judging Seibold yet, i still think he is getting it all wrong. We could put out a much better forward pack than he is picking.

 

[Super Freak]

I also dont think Flegler has been any better than Pat. In fact, i have consistently said since round one, and probably before as well, Flegler is a better option from the bench than Carrigan because he is more of an impact player.

You probably don't think Flegler has been better, but the reality is overall he has been. It's partly due to having more minutes which gives him more opportunity, but that's kind of beside the point.